A new day

[Graehstone]

Now it begins.
The days, weeks and months ahead are going to show the world what is underneath the veneer of our great country, we (the people) have been perceived by many outside our borders as weak and wishy-washy, indecisive and negligent in our duties to our country. We let too many things just happen.
We looked away.
The brow beating has now stopped, we have come to the realization that something needs to be done.
And “Yes it has.”
Now is the time to truly be the UNITED States of America.
We have lost so very much of the past in our headlong rush to embrace the future that we forget what it is we wanted to begin with.
I am happy for the democrats as at the same time I am saddened for the republicans because what passes for the republican party this day is a far cry from what the real and true republican charter was all about.
The republican concession speech was very inspiring, had this been the face and tone of the campaign, they surely would have won, or at the very least made it into a nail biter.
I am most excited that a man of color was chosen by us, I find that extraordinary for I never would have thought to see this in my lifetime, which in itself is a sad testament to my opinion of this country in that particular instance.
So it's nice to see that I can be wrong (more often than I like to admit actually, lol.)
You can only kick a dog so many times before he too turns and bites the hand that feeds it, and we've been kicked enough, it's time to do something, if not fight back then at least to take a stand and say “No more, no further, enough.”
Yesterday I woke to fear in my life as I have for many years and the last eight stoked by those who's duty is to make me feel safe.
Today I wake to a glimmer of hope, just a tiny glimmer, but by all that is good in the world it is Hope.

"I've learned that people will forget what you said, they will forget what you did, but they will never forget how you made them feel." - Maya Angelou

Today, I feel good. :hippie:

[Unkle_John]

I feel the same way brother.

[Hippie Staff]

I feel like it's ok to travel abroad again. The embarrassment of Bush is lifting.

What an exciting time - we needed this. I hope this brings everyone together, regardless of party lines. I know Republicans are disappointed this morning, but at the same time they can't deny the good energy, and the buzz - felt worldwide, about this new President.

Peace.

[Adam Blanchard]

I feel like it's ok to travel abroad again. The embarrassment of Bush is lifting.

What an exciting time - we needed this. I hope this brings everyone together, regardless of party lines. I know Republicans are disappointed this morning, but at the same time they can't deny the good energy, and the buzz - felt worldwide, about this new President.

Peace.

Amusingly when I had the oppertunity to meet two of the members of the band Behemoth, a polish black metal band, Bush was the topic of a few good laughs for both them and myself.

[Unkle_John]

I just got back from getting the car inspected, remember we live in a small town. Being there only 5 mins, I already heard the racist jokes and stupid shit like "they want change but they don't know what it is they want to change" and "...his preacher hates America and when asked, Obama would choose Muslim over Christianity".

I swear, I keep hearing morons like this and when they mentioned that they would leave if Obama was elected, I point south and say:

"There you go, no one is stopping you. You can trade one corrupt government for another. Maybe with people like you out of this country, we can make it better with out interference."

I don't know who this shriveled up old red neck was, be apparently he has nothing worthwhile to contribute, instead he's jockeying a stool at the local auto parts shop and wasting their time and spreading false information. Instead he could get up and offer his seat to a real customer and go and do something productive, like farm.

:mad:

[Adam Blanchard]

It really is sad to hear about things like that but unfortunately it is one of those crappy parts of life that we have to accept. People with those views, particularly of the older generation are stuck with those views and changing them is next to impossible. Worst part about it is often those kinds of opinions are taught to their children then their children's children. Only thing we can hope for is that the younger generations will look past their ancestral biases and form different opinions that encompass change and the abashment of racial and gender based prejudices.

[Crochety Carpenter]

Someone once said "A democracy will only survive as long as it takes for the people to vote for themselves benefits from the public largess" we are there.

"Taxes are not levied for the benefit of the taxed"
Robert Heinlein

"There is no worse tyrany than to force a man to pay for what he does not want merely because you think it would be good for him."
R. Heinlein

"Does history record any case in which the majority has been right"
R. Heinlein

[Hippie Staff]

STOP WITH THE MADE-UP TAX DRAMA!

Those who make over 250k have been sailing through the greatest tax loops in history, paying practically NOTHING . Meanwhile the rest of us schleps, have been paying a significant tax share. Why is it that Joe the Plummer, and all the other Republicans who make considerably LESS than $250k have the GREATEST issue with the next tax proposal. Wealthy people can pay the extra DINKY 4% on everything they make over $250k. 4% on monies CLEARED over 250k is not going to break ANYONE in this salary range.

There will be some great green-energy rebates coming. Guess which category of people will BEST afford to take advantage of these TAX REBATES..the WEALTHY. Solar panels, electric cars, etc. Not Cheap - but I'm glad they will be incentivized and will buy these items.

I figured out my tax break w/ Obama in office. I'm pleased.
Figure yours out here:
http://taxcut.barackobama.com/

BTW - "There is no worse tyrany than to force a man to pay for what he does not want merely because you think it would be good for him."
R. Heinlein

I concur with Heinlein. I didn't want to pay for the War...sorry, Invasion. However - Bush apparently thought it was good for me, and my child, and possibly her children. So, now that it's time to pay the piper -- why is it the PARTY that elected BUSH is complaining the loudest on Taxes? Who the hell is supposed to pay for his MESS?

[NCW_Woodnymph]

I checked. We'll keep an extra 30$. I'm not really convinced.

BTW, I totally agree that we should not be paying for the war especially when the Iraqis have oil money in there coffers.

[Crochety Carpenter]

Providing for the common defense, i.e. war, is a legitamate function of government under our constitution, redistribution of wealth is not.

Protecting those who cannot protect themselves, whether unborn young or aged is a legitamate function of government, ensuring a life of conveniance is not.

Providing equality of oppertunity is, providing equality of outcome is not.

That having been said I agree with you that this is not a legitamate war and was wrongly and ignorantly engaged. With or without WMDs Iraq had not invaded a neighbor for over 10 years. The first Bush could have legitamately removed Husein, the second Bush was indefensibly wrong. In spite of that, the damage is done and to abruptly withdraw now would be a greater wrong and will lead to vastly more deaths than even the withdrawal from Vietnam. You may have been wrong to start the fire but that doesn't release you from the responsibility of minimising the dammage.

P.S. Another Robert Hienline quote: "I never learned anything from someone with whom I agree"

[Adam Blanchard]

Looks like I'll be getting a little over $1,000 on my tax break plus the $4,000 for college expenses depending on the time limit on that because I'm in my last semester now and will be done by the end of the year.

[LIBRA]

Providing for the common defense, i.e. war, is a legitamate function of government under our constitution, redistribution of wealth is not.

Protecting those who cannot protect themselves, whether unborn young or aged is a legitamate function of government, ensuring a life of conveniance is not.

Providing equality of oppertunity is, providing equality of outcome is not.

You may have been wrong to start the fire but that doesn't release you from the responsibility of minimising the dammage.

P.S. Another Robert Hienline quote: "I never learned anything from someone with whom I agree"


Is taxing the middle class and letting big giant corporations slide through part of the legacy called america? Letting walmarts come in TAX FREE and when there time is up they move and develop down the block leaving that giant building vacant, build another complex stay there TAX FREE and just repeat the cycle till someone says hey..no no big corporations you cant get a free ride anymore? Is that a legitamate function of government under our constitution? So everyone crying over the redistrubution of wealth really needs to put a sock in it. Middle class has been bent over taking it you know where for far too long.

Seriously minimizing the damage???? Is that what McCain was calling it? I recall him saying we arent pulling out of Iraq untill "we win this thing" No one ever wins a war and the with a new leader Im hoping like hell the egotistical regime that has had you all duped will never ever have that chance again.

I always thought America, the land of the free. Truth, justice and our cival rights is what made us stand out as a great nation, over the last 8 year all of that has been takin from us. We know no truths, our cival liberties were invaded and justice is far from being served.

The times they are a changing, buckle up and enjoy the ride man :D I dont understand why people think is so bad and so scary, what weve gone through for the past 8 yrs has been scary.

[Shydog]

I agree with Libra. A war can only bring two nations to understand one another better. Lets move on with a new understanding, and with a new way.

[Gaston]

I just got back from getting the car inspected, remember we live in a small town. Being there only 5 mins, I already heard the racist jokes and stupid shit like "they want change but they don't know what it is they want to change" and "...his preacher hates America and when asked, Obama would choose Muslim over Christianity".

I swear, I keep hearing morons like this ...


I do too, Brother, I do too. The way I handle it is to calmly, quietly, tell them the truth.

The county water is coming our way, and I went out to talk to one of the flagmen. Just a chat, nothing more. He started by telling me about his wife's illness, saying "I prayed. I church-prayed, and Jesus helped the doctors make her well". OK, I can dig it. Then, he started on a different topic with "you know, I can't vote for a Muslim". I stayed calm and said "are you talking about Obama? Man, he's been going to the Church of Christ for 20 years. You aren't against the Church of Christ, are you?". He fell silent for a moment, and said "no shit?". "No shit", I said. "If you don't like him, that's fine, but don't let ignorant people fill your head full of crap." Then I asked him about something to do with the water, and left. I could tell from his face that I'd made a small change for the better.

You can't fight lies with lies. You can fight them with the quiet truth, and you can win. The fight isn't over yet, it's just begun. Stay cool, stay calm, and let the quiet truth win.

[Crochety Carpenter]

I could tell from his face that I'd made a small change for the better.

You can't fight lies with lies. You can fight them with the quiet truth, and you can win. The fight isn't over yet, it's just begun. Stay cool, stay calm, and let the quiet truth win.

Excelent response and philosophy.
Disagreeing agreably is the only way to find truth.